Honesty and Transparency
Interview with Huguette Labelle
By Bakhit Nurmukhametova, printed in Äåëîâîé Ìèð, No 3-4, 2009
What is the basis and goals of your visit to Kazakhstan?
I’ll mention two goals: Firstly, it’s the ten-year anniversary of Transparency Kazakhstan, part of our organization, Transparency International. We’re going to congratulate our colleagues. Secondly, it’s come to my attention that the Kazakh government wants to engage in intensive work in the fight against corruption. It was interesting for me to learn that your country has joined several international anticorruption conventions. These have already included the UN Convention Against Corruption and the UN Convention Against Narcotics and International Crime. The next important moment was when Kazakhstan submitted an application to join GRECO (European Countries Against Corruption). This prestigious organization assesses and monitors anticorruption efforts and measures and the rule of law not only in European countries, but in the former Soviet Union. Furthermore Kazakhstan plans to ratify the European Commission Convention Against Money Laundering. I think this is a very important and positive step towards creating a government without corruption.
Ms. Labelle, during your visit to Kazakhstan, you’ll be meeting President Nursultan Nazarbayev. What type of issues do you intend to discuss?
It’s a unique opportunity to discuss the current and future tendencies in the fight against corruption. Our branch of Transparency International has already worked in Kazakhstan for ten years. In these years we’ve accomplished a lot in the spheres of education, health care, and banking. The suggestions and recommendations of Transparency International are considered at the highest level, in the form of the Agency for the Fight Against Corruption and Economic Crime of the Republic of Kazakhstan. Together with our organization, Kazakhstan ratified the UN Convention Against Corruption, which is an essential element in fighting corruption.
How do you think the financial crisis has affected corruption globally?
The crisis has, without a doubt, affected everyone. Some have lost their jobs, some their houses, some their entire lives. I think some of the underlying causes of the crisis were shortcomings of transparency, honesty, and accountability in the private sector. We hope that the crisis will force governments, financial markets, and representatives of the private sector to take a closer look at the problems of corruption.
In 2008’s Corruption Perceptions Index, Kazakhstan was ranked 145th out of 180 countries. Not a great indicator…Do you think our country has a chance to improve on that ranking in this year’s index?
We hope the ranking will improve. The collection and analysis of data concludes at the end of August and we will hopefully release the Index in September.
How many countries are rated in the index? How many countries willingly give information for the index?
More than 180 countries are involved in the CPI. Ratings are based on the information’s of several independent researchers who survey businessmen (both foreign and domestic) and government officials.
Which countries are the most corrupt? What factors render the greatest influence on corruption ratings?
The last slots of the CPI are occupied by countries in states of stalled development. These states have weak political systems and are rife with internecine conflicts. These are countries like Sudan and Somalia. On the other end of the spectrum are the Scandinavian countries, located at high stages of democratic development, where the authorities are accountable to the society, the judicial system is strong and wholly independent, and the legal ramifications of corruption are extremely high.
It’s important to understand that corruption is complex and difficult to measure statistically; people don’t willingly discuss corruption. Within the framework of our research, we attempt to measure, in the first place, people’s perceptions of these issues.
Then there a second issue. The leadership of a country tries to eradicate corruption from its dealings and launches initiatives in the form of strict laws. But it can take a long time before such mechanisms show their effects and people begin to feel the changes and act accordingly. Societal actors, obviously, have an immediate influence on the ratings.
How great is the government’s role in the fight against corruption? Is the government the only actor in the fight against corruption?
The role of the government is extremely important, but not only the government should engage in fighting corruption. In the private sector, business associations and societal organizations must play a role and be involved. They are required for the fight against corruption to be an effective one.
How do we stop those or create barriers for those giving bribes? How do we fight it? Does Transparency International carry out work in this regard?
Transparency International works with people from some of the sectors most prone to bribery (construction, armed forces, business) and organizations in these sectors. Our fund tries to introduce proper, transparent practices to people from these fields in the hope that they can convey these standards and ethical practices to their colleagues.
What sectors are the most corrupt?
Transparency International carries out other research: “Global Coruption Barometer”. One of the questions we ask in this research is “what sector do you think is most corrupt?” Based on the results of this survey, I’d say the most corrupt sector is political parties, followed by parliament. After that, the judicial system, police, customs, and the private sector seem to be the most corrupt. These are general observations for the world as a whole. It can vary in individual countries. Where in one country it might be the private sector, in another it’s the armed forces or construction.
